Interview with Roger Ballen by / Mohsen Elbelasy

By

It was published in the second issue of the room surrealist magazine

La chambre 2
Deuxième numéro
version française

Cover par / Mohsen Elbelasy
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English versions
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The Second Issue of the Room surrealist Magazine

Surrealism and Africa

Book 1


https://drive.google.com/file/d/1NfbvALJ_4lnROl_qedlhjEZ1ku64JR-X/view?usp=drivesdk

Book 2


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Covers by / Zazie

1_ Sometimes your work is described as a surrealist photography .

But does Roger Ballen describe himself as a surrealist in the comprehensive, specific,and historical sense of the word?

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In other words, what does surrealism means to you?

Surrealism literally means “Above and Beyond”. The concept is based on the belief in a greater

reality that transcends human reason and rationality. Surrealism recognizes the significance of

the unexpected and the uncanny that emerges in dreams and can be expressed in artistic forms. I fully subscribe to this philosophy as my work seeks to release and make manifest the unconscious mind.

To be more specific – through the juxtaposition of unexpected circumstances, situations and

objects, I strive to present artworks that elicits a response from the viewer that draws out, taps

into aspects of themselves that they are not aware of in their rational everyday functioning.

I understand the historical sense of the word and honour and endorse Andre Breton’s 1924

definition in his Manifesto of Surrealism:

● Surrealism: Pure psychic autonomism by which it is intended to express…. the true

function of thought. Though dictated by the absence of all control exerted by reason.

To me personally surrealism means that artistic license to express a reality that transcends

rationality by creating fascinating, unsettling images of the familiar with the strange, to express

the rich inherent potential archive/repository of the human mind, that the subconscious can be

tapped as a creative force for the artist and the spectator, to unlock the power of imagination.

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2_ Surrealism and Africa

What comes to your mind when you put these two words next to each other?

Surrealism built on the Dada movement that was a response to middle-class complacency and

the belief in the absolute superiority and authority of the rational mind, Surrealism adopted this

Dadaist attitude which valued ‘chance’ and ‘the significance of the irrational.’

In contrast to Western society’s emphasis of rational thought and behaviour on individualism

and the nature of the self, African society places emphasis on communalism and collectivism

and on rituals and activities that are upheld and practiced for generations in a community –

often using time-honoured processes that are irrational. There is often no logic behind these

practices and there is the belief in higher-order spiritually and ancestry that are imaginary

forces.

Because I live in South Africa I am exposed to and am aware of the fact that rational order and

reasoning are not necessarily the “status quo” here in Africa. Superstition, ancient cultural

beliefs, and values as well as irrational practices like divination and dream symbolism are

valued more greatly that rational thought and deduction. Thus, the juxtaposition of “Surrealism”

and “Africa” seems completely appropriate to me.

There is a movement termed “Afro-Surrealism” in art and literature that has existed since the

1970s. In its manifesto it states that “Afro-Surrealists restore the cult of the past and they

presuppose that beyond this visible world, there is an invisible world striving to manifest, and it

is our job to uncover it.” The term Afro-surreal Expressionism was coined by Amiri Baraka in

1974.

3 _ We, as a Surrealist groups, always strive to communicate and work with other

Surrealist groups.

But we have not yet found other surrealist groups in Africa Since surrealism, as a whole, has been a victim of a reductionist process throughout its

history, do you see the idea of an organized surrealist group still important as a locomotive for contemporary art?

In other words, does Roger Ballan prefer an independent surrealist or a surrealist who is

involved in a surrealist group?

I fully recognize that the expression of the full complexity of the human mind is the responsibility

of sophisticated art and because of my belief in this I think that the Surrealist attitude will always

be extremely significant in contemporary art. I am not sure that organized groups are

necessary, but that is a personal opinion.

I do prefer to be an independent surrealist, since, as a person, I have always been an

individualist.

4_ A hundred years have passed since the founding of the surrealist movement, a

century in which human alienation develops in parallel with technological development

and capitalist brutality.

With your studies of psychology and the embodiment of these studies in your artistic

works over many years, your work always embodies the saturation of marginal societies

with alienation and brutality.

In 1924 the “Surrealist Revolution” magazine in Paris published a surrealist inquiry

It’s introduction was :

“We live, we die. What is the will’s part in all this? It seems we kill ourselves in the same

way we dream. It is not a moral question that we pose:

Is suicide a solution? As far as I am concerned, every individual has to decide on whether suicide is an option. I am not able to make decisions on this matter for the

whole of humanity What if we re-ask this question to you? There absolutely no reason I would like to

consider suicide. As I have no idea whatsoever what will happen to me on my death there is no reason to shorten my life on this planet when there is a good chance I will

disappear for eternity.

Is suicide a solution? The is no solution in living and no solution in suicide. Therefore, as I am living and creating meaning for myself and others I cannot contemplate what the point is of terminating my life.

5 _ I think you have a special concept of the phenomenology of objective chance, which is embodied in the neglected objects that you uses in your photographs to destroy the monotony of visual scenes of every day life.

If we look at your work over the past years, we will find that these creatures are linked by

some hidden link.

It is as if you are cumulatively creating an integrated forest of neglected and marginalized creatures and inanimate objects We want to know more about your philosophy of objective chance and of making

surrealist and brutal neglected creatures and objects .

I do not prepare my photographs before I start to work nor do I try to define my work through words. My images evolve sometimes through thousands of decisions that are primarily a result of my ability to create order from chaos, of linking one thing to another in such a way that a complex organic meaning is created.

The word chance is a much used term in photography that upon reflection is not as easy to understand as one would think. Fundamentally there is no chance, one creates the

circumstances that are responsible for events to take place.

Ultimately it is my goal in the images I create to be formally precise and to reveal content that is complex with associated deeper meanings.

6 _ I will tell you several names and words, and you will tell me what they represent to

you:

Andre Breton:

The creative founder of surrealism

Freud: One of the greatest geniuses in the history of mankind. He penetrated the depths

of the human psyche with an original and penetrating vision.

Man Ray: His photographs could be seen as the apex of surrealism in history of

photography

The rat : The rat symbolizes the Freudian Id in Western societies. This animal is an

archetype of chaos, disease, and the uncontrollable forces of nature

White color : White represents the false illusion that there is order in the world

Black Color : Black represents the part of the mind that we have repressed and want to

avoid at all costs.

metaphysics: Reality is unfathomable.

Samuel Beckett: I am grateful to Samuel Beckett as he introduced me to the concept of

absurdity in human existence.

The shadow

The shadow is the buried part of the mind that contains the essence of our

identity and of which we fear to come into contact with.

South Africa : The place on the planet that is home to the Ballenesque.

pig man: Sometimes I think it is an insult to a pig to call a human being one.

Theater : A crucial aspect of the Ballenesque aesthetic.

beauty : It is always difficult to know whether beauty is archetypal or cultural

ugliness: It is always difficult to know whether ugliness is archetypal or cutural

Impossible: To comprehend the meaning of life itself.

7_ How do you see the independent short film industry today in Africa?

There are thousands of so-called short films being produced every day in Africa. Like

everywhere else in the world one has to distinguish between short films that might be

seen as artworks versus being just personnel recording of one immediate environment.

There are many talented filmmakers in Africa, who are faced with the ongoing problem of

finance and distribution. Nevertheless, the internet has offered an alternative means to

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